SHADOW MINISTER FOR INFRASTRUCTURE, TRANSPORT AND REGIONAL DEVELOPMENT – TRANSCRIPT – AM AGENDA SKY
TRANSCRIPT
Senator the Hon Bridget McKenzie
Shadow Minister for Infrastructure, Transport and Regional Development
Leader of The Nationals in the Senate
Tuesday 16 August 2022
AM Agenda on Sky with Laura Jayes
E&OE
Laura Jayes
Let’s bring in Bridget McKenzie now, she joins us live. Shadow Infrastructure minister Bridget McKenzie, good to see you. We’ve got a kind of explanation from Scott Morrison this morning. Well, what did you think of it?
Senator McKenzie
Yeah, great to be with you Laura. I think it does require an explanation. Obviously our Government during COVID delivered an unprecedented positive response in terms of to a global pandemic in unprecedented times. The Biosecurity Act gave incredible powers to the health minister. As a Conservative I don’t think we should be having too much power concentrated on any one person in a Government. So that was an easy explanation around the health minister powers and the health minister at the time knew it. But this still does not answer the questions about obviously the other portfolios and whether there were other ministers who weren’t actually having the authority that they thought they did under the oath they took in front of the Governor General. So I think there does need to be an explanation about other portfolios. Were there other ministers who were acting without authority? And as you said in your opening remarks, there is going to be a lot of implications as a result of the revelations that have come to light in recent days.
Laura Jayes
Scott Morrison has tried to explain or justify this morning. I don’t know whether you heard any of that on with 2GB Radio with Ben Fordham this morning, but the explanation seems to be that he took over a finance just in case, but never use those powers. When it comes to the resources portfolio though it seems like the Prime Minister was using the cover of the pandemic to then use his power and subvert the minister there.
Senator McKenzie
Well, these are the sorts of questions Laura that absolutely need to be answered. I think Australians rightly understand the health ministers unprecedented powers under the Biosecurity Act and that needed additional oversight in these unprecedented times. But when it comes to the Finance Minister and the Resources Minister, we do need to understand why. Because as even the Australian editorial today said, even if it was just for political reasons, it’s a disgrace. We have a parliamentary system that’s based on convention. Very strong conventions around cabinet solidarity, ministerial responsibility and authority and we need to make sure those conventions were upheld.
Laura Jayes
Well, this is the explanation in a nutshell that he offered this morning on the Keith Pitt issue. He said I sought to be the decision maker in that case. Then he went on to say that essentially. We don’t really understand the technicality and essentially this decision on that project didn’t have cabinet oversight, therefore he wanted to make the decision. Does that stack up to you?
Senator McKenzie
Well Laura, when I take the oath of office and bestowed the authority of a minister by the Governor General in this country, that’s a serious – it’s not just like any other job with the PD and KPIs to meet – you are bestowed that authority by the Crown. Even if you’re going on leave, you have to give that authority to another Minister to exercise it to make the decisions on your behalf whilst you’re on leave. So, to have two ministers effectively able to exercise that authority, were both Mr Pitt and Mr. Morrison able to exercise the authority at the same time or not? These are serious questions about ministerial responsibility that do need to be answered. In a cabinet position you come into the room as a as a minister to argue your perspective with that authority around the table and the Prime Minister is chair of that meeting, listens to his or her ministers, and then obviously provides some advice back to cabinet. I just find it difficult to appreciate where the lines of decision making were and who held the authority in that time and who actually knew about it and what did the National Party know that Keith Pitt wasn’t technically the minister that we thought it was at the time.
Laura Jayes
I’m assuming you didn’t know.
Senator McKenzie
No, well, I wasn’t actually in cabinet for the majority of 2020, so I didn’t know and it sounds like I wasn’t the only one if the commentary over the last couple of days is anything to go by.
Laura Jayes
I mean the logic that has been proffered by the former Prime Minister this morning. It makes you question then what is the point of having a cabinet table where ideas are thrashed out and then you make a decision as a cabinet. And what is the point of having a minister in giving them these responsibilities?
Senator McKenzie
Well, exactly if you, if you’re a minister without authority, you’re actually not a minister and so did Mr. Pitt know that? did the leader of the Nationals know that? Our cabinet processes are really, really important. The conventions that we operate in this country as a constitutional monarchy rather than a Republic with a president are really important, and it is about spreading risks, spreading power, spreading decision making and obviously during a global pandemic there are going to be a smaller group of people having to be able to make serious decisions on the impacts on Australians, our economy, and our health in very short time. But that should not dilute the importance of cabinet.
Laura Jayes
Sure, but on the resources issue, Bridget McKenzie, during the pandemic we gave – and I’m talking about the Australian public – gave the government the benefit of the doubt. They had extraordinary power and extraordinary control over our lives. This little episode does show that the Prime Minister of the day perhaps took advantage of that.
Senator McKenzie
Well, that needs to be explained. I mean and they are genuine questions that you’re raising Laura and that people around the community are wanting to understand who knew what when. Was it only three? I’ve been in meetings this morning, so I haven’t seen former Prime Minister Morrison response, but they are genuine, serious and sensible questions to be asking at a point like this.
Laura Jayes
OK, before I let you go, I mean there’s not a lot of people defending him either.
Senator McKenzie
Hey Angus! Sorry, we’ve got our shadow cabinet in Tasmania today.
Laura Jayes
I’m so glad.
Senator McKenzie
So I’ve just seen the Shadow Treasurer walk past.
Laura Jayes
I mean, maybe you can ask Angus, maybe you can ask Taylor what he thinks about this as well. But before I let you go, there’s not many people willing to defend Scott Morrison actions here, both publicly or privately. What does this say about his character?
Senator McKenzie
Look, Laura, I’m very upfront about this. I personally take our conventions and the issues around transparency, accountability, ministerial responsibility and our conventions under the Westminster system very, very seriously, personally. I don’t want to see any dilution of that, and Australians rightfully, may have lessened their confidence in political institutions and this is an opportunity to restore their confidence and restore the practice of cabinet solidarity, ministerial responsibility and the Westminster convention.
Laura Jayes
Well ok good to see Angus Taylor with you there in Tassie. Let him know we got a few questions for him about portfolios, whether he knew about Scott Morrison as well. So, if he wants to come on let him know we’re still on for an hour and a half.
Senator McKenzie
I will I will.
Laura Jayes
Thanks, Bridget. We’ll see you soon.
